ThirdAge: You, Steve, said "all marriages are mixed marriages." Could you say more about the commonalities and differences in your marriage?
Steve: The most basic difference in most marriages is between a man and a woman, and the difference between a Catholic and a Jew compared to the difference between a man and a woman is [laughs] tiny.
TA: But then you read your book and one gets the sense of how much more you have in common with each other than you have differences.
Steve: Much more.
TA: And that's a really positive message compared to some of the things that are going on in our culture, such as these divisive self-help books like "Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus." The message is that we're from opposing planets, and that's not true. We have more in common.
Cokie: We do have more in common. But it is useful, however, to understand that men and women approach things differently.
It took us years, for instance, to get to what they probably say right straight in these books, which is that I would come home from something and say, "Oh God, they drove me crazy today. He said this and she said that." And Steve would say, "Well here's how you fix it." And I didn't want to have it fixed. I wanted him to listen to me, to pay attention to me, and to sympathize with me. And now we actually have a saying for it, which is, 'This is a poor baby moment.'
TA: In the book, Steve, you mention that you used to be angry about how often Cokie interrupted you, but then you read the linguist Deborah Tannen's book about differences in male and female communication and that kind of cleared up some gender speech issues. [Cokie laughs.] But seriously, how has your communication changed over the years? Has it become more intimate?
Cokie: I actually don't think it's changed much. The difference is that he doesn't mind it as much. [Cokie laughs and Steve laughs.] We've always talked a great deal and always had a lot to say to each other, but it is true that he thought that he should have the floor, and--what a concept--that's not the way women talk.
Steve: I think that over a long period of time, it's sort of a joke, but it's true. You finish each other's sentences. You know what each other is thinking even before the other person says it. This only comes from years and years of conversation.
Cokie: Your children start to think you're very dotty, you know. He says half a word and I say, "I know, I know, I've got it under control." And the children ask: "What are they talking about?" [Laughs].
TA: So your communication is becoming like you've got ....
Cokie: One mind [Laughs]
TA: A telepathy going on here.
Steve: Well, it's shared experience.
TA: Is that why you structured your book that way?
Cokie: Yeah, well, it's a couple of things. One was, that we did want to just evoke that. But the other was that we've written together for years and years. But when you write together you do have to find a common voice. And it's impossible to find a common voice about marriage. You experience it differently. So we thought it was important to tell our bit in two voices. Next: Choosing Your Battles >
Back to Intro
ThirdAge: You, Steve, said "all marriages are mixed marriages." Could you say more about the commonalities and differences in your marriage?
